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  #1  
Old 07-08-2015, 07:01 PM
spride spride is offline
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Default Use Case for the AU MIDI plugin?

Hi,

I'm evaluating Numerology and I appreciate all the thought and hard work that went into the design. I've been searching and reading in the forums and still I'm not sure what the purpose of the AU MIDI Plugin version of N4 might be.

In my naiveté I thought that I could assign it as a MIDI plugin to a software instrument track in Logic Pro X, set up a sequence, hit Record, and the sequence would play the instrument which would then be recorded much as if I'd played those notes by hand on an external MIDI controller. However some (old) threads on this forum say that it doesn't work like that and that MIDI plugins don't have the ability/permission to write data to the tracks they're on.

In the nicest possible way can I ask what the MIDI plugin version is for, then? Is there a use case for it that I can't think of? And is there still no way to do what I describe above without using Rewire?

Many thanks - sorry to ask such a basic question.

Simon
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Old 07-08-2015, 07:31 PM
jim jim is offline
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[I've expanded my answer a bit for when other folks have similar questions…]

So there are three Numerology plugin types: VST, AU, and AU MIDI Effect. For any host that supports VSTs, the N4 VST is the best plugin option, as all VST hosts that I know of can route MIDI from VSTs accurately (i.e. no latency or jitter). A few hosts handle MIDI from both AUs and VSTs equally well (audiomulch, bidule, Studio One).

Before LogicX, the N4 AU was also the only plugin option for Logic, but Logic 9 and earlier do not handle MIDI from plugins, so you had to resort to IAC busses and trickery in the Logic Environment -- not much fun.

With LogicX, and AU MIDI Effects, the situation is much better -- the plugin sits between the MIDI Input of an instrument track and the instrument, and LogicX correctly reads and forwards MIDI from the AU MX plugin, no jitter or latency, etc.

However, as you suggest, Logic doesn't let you record the MIDI output from a MIDI Effect -- or pipe it to any other tracks. In most cases with Numerology, I don't see this as an issue. If you're building sequences in Numerology -- either by editing, the Launchpad, realtime recording or non-realtime recording, the sequencer modules will remember what your'e doing. You can use stack presets to save multiple patterns and then use the preset playlist to build arrangements. You can also drag MIDI clips out of Numerology stacks directly into MIDI tracks in Logic (or other hosts).

Also, keep in mind there are two other integration options: you can use ReWire, which is often better if you like to use lots of stacks. Or you can use plain old MIDI Sync…

Cheers,
Jim
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  #3  
Old 07-09-2015, 04:12 AM
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Per Boysen Per Boysen is offline
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Yes, you are right that Logic X can't record MIDI generated by the same track's MIDI plugins. But there is an excellent third-party AU MIDI plugin that lets you catch the MIDI and paste it in anywhere in Logic: the MIDI FX Freeze. Just throw it in after the Numerology MIDI plugin, activate its capturing function and run Logic for the part you want to capture. Than drag the Num stuff out and place it as a Logic MIDI Region anywhere you fancy.
http://www.audiocr.com/midi-fx-freeze/
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Old 07-09-2015, 12:00 PM
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m5tevens m5tevens is offline
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This is insane ... why doesn't Logic "just do" this? Is Logic, by any chance, able to deal with multi-channel midi from plugins? Using the VST in Live is great, aside from the lack of multi-channel support ... I used Logic for quite a long time, going back to it is something I would consider if I could get channelized midi out of the N4 plugin with it.

I've been doing my composition in the N4 stand-alone and recording midi files that I import as clips in Live. For the most part, this has been working really well, and I've found separating my workflow into 'composition' and 'production' phases in different applications to be a good thing. The only bummer is when I record a take or two that I'm happy with and find out I forgot to run midi to an output on a plugin track or forget to set a midi destination and have to re-do it. Obviously not a solution for people automating params in their plugins, unfortunately, although I guess one could always record the applicable tracks as audio.

I'm thinking of having a look at Vienna Ensemble Pro after I finish my current project (thanks technoBear, had no idea anybody managed to make this sort of thing work before you mentioned it in another thread here!)

It's almost like the DAW vendors go out of their way to make midi-generating plugins a pain to deal with ...
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  #5  
Old 07-09-2015, 03:47 PM
Aramis Aramis is offline
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Default N4 Pro and DigitalPerformer is my choice.....

I am not a pro but I am having fun with DigitalPerformer since long time with multiple keyboards and multiple pads because midi selections is easy with this daw. So, N4 is for me a perfect complement.
Logic X is good for a lot of things but the way midi selections works is horrible.
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Old 11-03-2015, 02:48 AM
Benzebub Benzebub is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jim View Post
You can also drag MIDI clips out of Numerology stacks directly into MIDI tracks in Logic (or other hosts).
How do you do that? I have tried to find it in the manual but have not found the answer.
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Old 11-03-2015, 01:50 PM
Benzebub Benzebub is offline
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I found it. It was the note at the bottom. .)
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Old 11-03-2015, 11:37 PM
zaxmalloy zaxmalloy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Per Boysen View Post
Yes, you are right that Logic X can't record MIDI generated by the same track's MIDI plugins. But there is an excellent third-party AU MIDI plugin that lets you catch the MIDI and paste it in anywhere in Logic: the MIDI FX Freeze. Just throw it in after the Numerology MIDI plugin, activate its capturing function and run Logic for the part you want to capture. Than drag the Num stuff out and place it as a Logic MIDI Region anywhere you fancy.
http://www.audiocr.com/midi-fx-freeze/
Thanks for the tip on MIDI FX Freeze - very functional. Have you tired their other MIDI plug in Capture MIDI?
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